TOO MUCH MONKEY BUSINESS: The Elvis Forum

A FREE & INDEPENDENT ELVIS PRESLEY DISCUSSION SITE ADMINISTERED BY FANS.
It is currently Sun May 20, 2012 10:48 pm

All times are UTC [ DST ]



Welcome
You are currently viewing our message board as a guest, which gives you limited access to most discussions. By joining our Elvis Presley fan community you will be able to contribute to topics & create threads, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. You will also be able to view the board without the "in-text" advertising that's shown only to guests & non logged-in members. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free! So, please join us now at TOO MUCH MONKEY BUSINESS: The Elvis Forum.




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 50 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:22 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2010 11:59 am
Posts: 10
Location: Orange Bowl Regatta
Moved this from FECC to here for you to "enjoy" - although I know there aren't many jumpsuit junkies here. Sorry about that. :oops:

Having found some additional photos from this date (and re-dated others) along with some additional info, thought I'd do another concert expose - this will be my fourth one. Having covered shows from 1976, 1974 & 1977, it's time to do one on a 1975 concert - so it's Greensboro 1975.

The show was announced on Thursday, March 20th by the Greensboro Coliseum staff. There was no advertising as such, but the tickets sold out quickly, anyway - by 3PM the next day, they were gone. A lot ended up with scalpers, which once again prompted heated discussion in the local papers come July. For now, though, there were just a lot of disappointed people:
ImageImage

Usual pleas for an additional concert were heard but no avail:

Image

This would mark Elvis' third visit to Greensboro Coliseum; he would return two more times - the 1976 visit would prompt the "place to get the f*** out of" remark. The coliseum had been built in 1959, and at the time of Elvis' visits seated around 15-16000 people. Note how one of the clippings above mentions a new attendance record, but similar number of spectators were reported for the two earlier visits, also. The coliseum was expanded in 1991, and it now seats around 23000 people.
Image

Here's the interior of the coliseum today:
Image

Elvis arrived in Greensboro directly after the infamous show at the Norfolk Scope, in which two of the Sweets and Kathy had walked off the stage. Things were patched up with the Sweets, so that they reappeared on stage that night, but Kathy still refused to go on. Here's Elvis leaving Norfolk:
Image

Upon arrival he checked into the local Hilton Hotel. On the way over he had developed a toothache, which prompted a 5 AM visit to the local dentist, Dr. J. Baxter Caldwell. The finishing touches on the problem tooth were done after the show at 1 AM the following morning. Naturally, all of this was dutifully covered by the local press in detail. We learned that "Elvis was in terrific pain when he arrived...a Demerol had failed to kill the pain...[the procedure] left a rough spot that his tongue kept bumping into during last night's concert...'he was a really nice person. Very friendly,' said Dr. Caldwell's receptionist..." Dr. Caldwell didn't think the dental work would be visible to concert goers. "Remember, he's got very big lips."
Image

The concert began at the usual hour 8.30 PM, with Elvis coming on stage at around 10 PM. Here's Elvis leaving the Hilton and then stepping on the Coliseum stage.
ImageImage

The concert itself is somewhat of a mystery as there is no audio or video material available, as far as I know. The song-listing originates from a fan review - it may or may not be accurate:
Quote:
C.C. Rider / I Got A Woman- Amen / Big Boss Man / Love Me / If You Love Me / Love Me Tender / All Shook Up / Teddy Bear - Don't Be Cruel / Hound Dog / The Wonder Of You / Polk Salad Annie / Introductions / Johnny B. Goode / School Days / T.R.O.U.B.L.E / Why Me Lord / How Great Thou Art (w. reprise) / Let Me Be There / Funny How Time Slips Away / Little Darlin’ / Mystery Train - Tiger Man / Can't Help Falling In Love

Image

The only assessment of the show must based on local reviews. The Greensboro Daily News reported enthusiastically:

Image
Quote:
Then, at 9:55 PM, the old familiar fanfare began. The stage was dark, the trumpets blared and the timpani rolled, as deafening screams filled the Coliseum. The King was back. He was still their King of Rock 'n' Roll, and he was better than ever...

He talked about having to go to the dentist today because a filling fell out of his tooth last night. He admitted to being a bit tired after a rafter-shaking rendition of Poke Salad Annie and sat down on the stage to rest. Through all this relaxed show, which included fewer of the golden oldies and more gospel and recent material, Elvis seemed to be having fun while earning a fortune. The audience had fun, too.

There was plenty of fun for Elvis fans in the Coliseum, but they also got their money's worth in the music department. Elvis' voice was so good; so versatile and so powerful, especially on How Great Thou Art, that the audience stood and cheered for more of the same. Elvis repeated part of the song. The King of Rock 'n' Roll seems to perform better with each added year. He is in great voice, and he can control an audience with half-inch move of a muscle. That's real superstar, with a super show.


Elvis sitting down after Polk Salad Annie...

Image

...and most likely belting out the last notes of How Great Thou Art to an appreciative Greensboro audience! :wink:

Image

The review in the paper of the neighboring Winston-Salem was not any less enthusiastic (just check the title):

Image

Quote:
Elvis may be overweight, but his show has just the right amount of heft, muscle and grace. Elvis knows he’s no longer 19 years old, and he is a delightful self-parodist. A few bumps and grinds, a little playing with the guitar, tossing his head forward and shaking his legs – he’s laughing at himself. If the worshipers take the delicious moves as articles of faith, so be it. That makes it fun...

The hips are too much with Elvis, the stomach is ludicrous. But the voice…now that, as the British say in another context, is a little bit of all right. He was best in the full-throated ballads: The Wonder of You, Burning Love, Fools Rush In and the gospel song How Great Thou Art, which got enough of an ovation to merit a reprise. A huge voice when he wants it to be, it has grown in power and assurance as Elvis has matured. It is filled with warmth and affection for the audience which was returned in double measure.

Image

During the concert, Elvis apparently apologized to the Sweets. And yet again children in jumpsuits were hoisted upon him, as a 7 year old boy named Mitch was lifted on stage. Elvis reportedly had a lot of fun with him. I seem to recall MItch's wife inquiring at Facebook some time ago about whether there was additional photo and/or video material from this moment. I only got this low resolution photo of this moment - anyone have this in better quality - or even more from this moment?
Image

Oh yes, and remember that Kathy was not there. Apparently the two met in the hotel corridor after the concert. From Kathy's book:
Quote:
I saw Elvis coming back from the show that night in Greensboro, but ignored him. He was with a girl I didn't recognize. It was an uncomfortable moment for both of us. We were walking toward each other down a long corridor. As we passed one another in the middle of the hallway he shot me a look of disgust.

Later in the evening Elvis presented Kathy a choice of gifts: either a wristwatch or a gun! Kathy tried to play it cool in that situation: she then agreed to stay until the end of the tour, but leave when it was over. But as we know, she was back with Elvis in August. Below the only shot I've seen where you can see the empty spot at where Kathy should be.

Image

With concert over Elvis returned to the local dentist, as already mentioned. He then spent the night in the local Hilton.
Image

The adventures of the Elvis troupe in Greensboro 1975 were not quite over. The next day, Elvis was scheduled to leave for Asheville at 4.30 PM. At two, he decided it was time to leave. After everyone had boarded the bus, Elvis decided he was staying a little longer, but told the others to leave anyway. This pissed everyone off, and they stopped for ice cream on the way to the airport. While they were enjoying that treat, Elvis passed by and was "pissed". At the airport he ordered everyone off the plane, and took off leaving them behind - and then sending the plane back to pick them up. For all of that, he seems quite amicable in the photos boarding his plane in Greensboro - taking the time to wave to fans seeing him off.

Image

So that about covers it all. Here's hoping that audio and/or video of this show will surface in the future - possibly in the form of a soundboard recording? To conclude this piece, a couple of date corrections for photos commonly dated for the Greensboro: the one on the left is from Uniondale and the one on the right from Asheville (note to Francesc!) :)

Image

If anyone can add any pertinent information, please feel free to do so!


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:09 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2010 3:05 am
Posts: 699
Thank you so much ! Cool stuff


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:02 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2010 11:57 am
Posts: 1198
Location: SAM"s 2nd home!...4 years on!.
What a horror of a jumpsuit!.

Good work on that day Scott!.

_________________
KEV.

Just A View!.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:03 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member

Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2010 5:48 pm
Posts: 52
a great read - thanks Scott.! Too bad untill today no good soundboard of this tour popped up. He seemed to be in very good voice.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:53 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:38 pm
Posts: 852
Location: Scotland
A good article, well put together.
Keep 'em coming.
Jim


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:29 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 11:17 am
Posts: 1668
that's great thanks Scott. Love how the newspaper refers to Burning Love as a ballad and mentions `Fools Rush In'


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:44 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:01 am
Posts: 1119
Location: West Malibu (via Sydney, Australia)
Brilliant, Scott!
Thanks for making the effort.

_________________
Image
"I can dance with a drink in my hand."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:21 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:02 pm
Posts: 214
Location: Zevenhoven
KEV wrote:
What a horror of a jumpsuit!.

Good work on that day Scott!.


If only Ger Rijff would return to share his views on the jumpsuit... :wink:
Although Elvis still did great gigs in 1975 I personally think his stage wear was less great to put it mildly.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 2:14 pm 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 12:31 pm
Posts: 3622
Location: In the jungle
Alexander wrote:
KEV wrote:
What a horror of a jumpsuit!.

Good work on that day Scott!.


If only Ger Rijff would return to share his views on the jumpsuit... :wink:
Although Elvis still did great gigs in 1975 I personally think his stage wear was less great to put it mildly.


His stage wear was a joke from 1972 onwards. It was awful, worse than Liberace's.

_________________
Hey hey we're the Monkeys...
I'm the king of the swingers, a jungle VIP.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 2:21 pm 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2010 10:48 pm
Posts: 8723
Location: GRAVESEND
John wrote:
His stage wear was a joke from 1972 onwards.
It was awful, worse than Liberace's.


It seems there was no-one around him with the courage to say: "Look, Elvis, your stage get-up is starting to make you look a complete fool !"

What you get for surrounding yourself with 'yes-men' I guess..........

_________________
Colin B
Judge a man not by his answers, but by his questions - Voltaire


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:41 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member

Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2010 5:48 pm
Posts: 52
His stage wear was not that bad in my opinion. It was part of the show back then. They toured with only about 6 spots if i remember well.? Looking at the stage wear of other performances it was not that bad at all. Look at Queen in 70's or Elton John - would you consider what they wear tastefull.?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:57 pm 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2010 10:48 pm
Posts: 8723
Location: GRAVESEND
Hans wrote:
His stage wear was not that bad in my opinion. It was part of the show back then. They toured with only about 6 spots if i remember well.? Looking at the stage wear of other performances it was not that bad at all. Look at Queen in 70's or Elton John - would you consider what they wear tastefull.?


Then again, they weren't The King of Rock 'n' Roll, were they ?

_________________
Colin B
Judge a man not by his answers, but by his questions - Voltaire


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 7:26 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member

Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2010 5:48 pm
Posts: 52
ColinB wrote:
Hans wrote:
His stage wear was not that bad in my opinion. It was part of the show back then. They toured with only about 6 spots if i remember well.? Looking at the stage wear of other performances it was not that bad at all. Look at Queen in 70's or Elton John - would you consider what they wear tastefull.?


Then again, they weren't The King of Rock 'n' Roll, were they ?



Damn Right ColinB


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:06 am 
Offline
Monkey Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:48 am
Posts: 32
I saddly never got to see Elvis live, for a number of reason, One I was born in 1967, so I was 10 when he passed, and two I lived in Ireland until I 1988. But i have been in the Greensboro Col. many times to see Bruce Springsteen, and everytime I enter the arena, I always remind my wife that Elvis played here. So thats my only input to the Greensboro show.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 8:38 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 12:31 pm
Posts: 3622
Location: In the jungle
Hans wrote:
His stage wear was not that bad in my opinion. It was part of the show back then. They toured with only about 6 spots if i remember well.? Looking at the stage wear of other performances it was not that bad at all. Look at Queen in 70's or Elton John - would you consider what they wear tastefull.?


No I wouldn't, but there was a difference.

Elvis looked cool in 1969, 1970 and maybe into 1971. As the outfits got more colourful and flamboyant, he started looking ridiculous. I'm not taking a retrospective view, I lived through those times and whilst Queen, Elton John, Gary Glitter, Bowie and others wore those outfits, it fitted with their music, their musical persona and general fashion at the time.

Elvis was older and his style of music was different too. He looked incredibly silly. I know he wanted to put on a show, but he got his attire wrong.

I would be interested to know if any of his friends, henchmen, family, asrelickers advisors or anyone else ever told him he looked stupid.

_________________
Hey hey we're the Monkeys...
I'm the king of the swingers, a jungle VIP.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 9:26 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:01 am
Posts: 1119
Location: West Malibu (via Sydney, Australia)
I guess it's all a matter of taste, I liked the look, to me it was of its time......the choker he wore I find quite flattering on him.
I suppose all the hangers on may have shared the same tastes and moreover, I'm sure Elvis had mirrors in the various dressing rooms he used?
I think this kind of OTT clothing was viewed from a completely different perspective by someone whose formative years were in the southern United States during the 1940s & 50s.

Having said all that, at the end of the day, to me it was all about the music.

_________________
Image
"I can dance with a drink in my hand."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 11:10 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 12:31 pm
Posts: 3622
Location: In the jungle
Kris P wrote:
I guess it's all a matter of taste, I liked the look, to me it was of its time......the choker he wore I find quite flattering on him.
I suppose all the hangers on may have shared the same tastes and moreover, I'm sure Elvis had mirrors in the various dressing rooms he used?
I think this kind of OTT clothing was viewed from a completely different perspective by someone whose formative years were in the southern United States during the 1940s & 50s.

Having said all that, at the end of the day, to me it was all about the music.


You'd think it was about the music, and indeed it should be. Sadly too many people remember the clothing and ridicule him for it.

Not only did he have mirrors, obviously he saw the photographs, he had photos taken of himself posing in them, he saw the drawings for the outfits and he saw the finished articles before he put them on, he knew full well what he was wearing. A matter of taste? Yes, bad taste. As Colin said, this was the King of Rock 'n' Roll. He should have worn cooler clothing. The jumpsuits were not cool, not then, not now.

Yes the OTT clothing was viewed differently, you only have to look at some of the country singers and the stuff they wore. Elvis should have been above that but I don't think he knew fully how he was perceived. His own image of himself was very different to the one the serious fans had of him. Maybe we still thought of him as, or hoped he would still be, the rebel. Sadly he saw himself as Captain Marvel.

The nearest comparison I can draw is Tom Jones. He went through a short patch where he wore dodgy clothing, but in the main he got it right and he looks great.

Those jumpsuits were a joke. Glen Campbell, Engelbert Humperdinck, Neil Diamond, The Osmonds, Mick Jagger, Gary Glitter and others all gave it a go. None of them kept up with for as long as Elvis did and none of them were as flamboyant, apart from maybe Gary Glitter.

Sorry, but I think it was a huge mistake.

_________________
Hey hey we're the Monkeys...
I'm the king of the swingers, a jungle VIP.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 11:25 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:01 am
Posts: 1119
Location: West Malibu (via Sydney, Australia)
No worries John, one man's meat is another man's poison.

As for those who ridicule him for his choice of clobber, is that the type of opinion you would put any stock in? Not me.

_________________
Image
"I can dance with a drink in my hand."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:50 pm 
Offline
Monkey Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 10:37 am
Posts: 355
Scott, thanks so much for a fantastic thread! There are some jumpsuit junkies among us, and your efforts are much appreciated.

As for the suit, those two suits from 1975, the Gypsy and Aztec suits, really seem to divide opinion. Of the two, this one appeals more, but certainly, they were among the most elaborate. I can't find any newspaper reviews from the time where they say Elvis looks ridiculous, or stupid, and I think under the stage lights, there in person, they'd look pretty amazing. I do like some of the suits from 72 onwards, including some of the 1974 suits. Nothing could save the two prehistoric bird suits from 1976, but generally, i think they worked for him. I remember reading in Keith Alverstons book how pleased the crowd were to see him back in Jumpsuits in May / June 75 after the 2 piece suits worn earlier, that year, so clearly the fans of the time liked them.

Here's part of a review, courtesy of Fransesc's site, from The New York Times from July 75. commenting on the suit.
Quote:
Saturday afternoon's costume had been laboriously conceived to disguise and distract attention from his size, and its most striking aspect was its sheer lavishness: basically black, bell bottom pants and a vest over a puffy, double sleeve shirt, but extravagantly overlaid with "jewels" (presumably rhinestones) arranged in baroque exaggeration of American Indian designs. It looked wonderful.

You'd have thought if any paper was going to ridicule Elvis if he looked ridiculous, or stupid, it would be the New York Times.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:59 pm 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:01 am
Posts: 1119
Location: West Malibu (via Sydney, Australia)
Darrylmac wrote:
You'd have thought if any paper was going to ridicule Elvis if he looked ridiculous, or stupid, it would be the New York Times.

That's a pretty good point, Darryl.

_________________
Image
"I can dance with a drink in my hand."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 7:50 pm 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 12:31 pm
Posts: 3622
Location: In the jungle
Kris P wrote:
No worries John, one man's meat is another man's poison.

completely agree with you.

As for those who ridicule him for his choice of clobber, is that the type of opinion you would put any stock in? Not me.


Very probably, because I plainly think it was ridiculous.

_________________
Hey hey we're the Monkeys...
I'm the king of the swingers, a jungle VIP.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 2:06 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:01 am
Posts: 1119
Location: West Malibu (via Sydney, Australia)
John wrote:
Those jumpsuits were a joke. Glen Campbell, Engelbert Humperdinck, Neil Diamond, The Osmonds, Mick Jagger, Gary Glitter and others all gave it a go..........

Now this is ridiculous......



.....and not a jumpsuit in sight!

_________________
Image
"I can dance with a drink in my hand."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 2:14 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 12:31 pm
Posts: 3622
Location: In the jungle
Kris P wrote:
John wrote:
Those jumpsuits were a joke. Glen Campbell, Engelbert Humperdinck, Neil Diamond, The Osmonds, Mick Jagger, Gary Glitter and others all gave it a go..........

Now
Quote:
this
is ridiculous!


On that we agree Kris. He got paid for that!

_________________
Hey hey we're the Monkeys...
I'm the king of the swingers, a jungle VIP.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 2:57 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:01 am
Posts: 1119
Location: West Malibu (via Sydney, Australia)
Tough way to make a livin'......at least that's how someone put it.

_________________
Image
"I can dance with a drink in my hand."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Greensboro July 21 1975 - a look back
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 4:48 am 
Offline
Monkey Helper
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:01 am
Posts: 1119
Location: West Malibu (via Sydney, Australia)
Here's some pics of Elvis at Piedmont Triad International Airport (Greensboro), July 22 1975, enroute to Asheville. Also pictured is Elvis meeting with the local Greensboro constabulary at the same location.

Image Image

Image

Image Image

Image

_________________
Image
"I can dance with a drink in my hand."


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 50 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Davide and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
suspicion-preferred